Some bands have spirituality in their lyrics, some have blatant Christian imagery but I believe metal is about the music. "Christian" metal is criminally underappreciated and it's because people are so against people with beliefs. Listen to these bands and hopefully your hearts will soften a little.


Divinefire (Symphonic power metal)- www.myspace.com/divinefireofficial

Paramaecium (Death/doom)- www.myspace.com/paramaecium

Sacrificium (Death/thrash)- www.myspace.com/sacrificiummetal

Crimson Moonlight (Death/black)- www.myspace.com/officialcrimsonmoonlight

Tortured Conscience (Death)- www.myspace.com/torturedconscience

Frost Like Ashes (Death/black)- www.myspace.com/frostlikeashes

Once Dead (Thrash)- www.myspace.com/oncedeadband

My Silent Wake (Death/doom)- www.myspace.com/mysilentwake

Antestor (Symphonic Black)- www.myspace.com/antestorband

Cerimonial Sacred- (Black)- www.myspace.com/cerimonialsacredfanpage

awwww, aint that sweet

FUCK OFF!!!

what about Stryper

I'm not counting Stryper because hair 'metal' doesn't exist anymore.

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

they aren't hair metal but w/e

What would you consider them?

They were hair metal in the 80's, man.

garbage, like the rest of these fucking joke bands.

that band ONCE DEAD has such bad vocals...music was decent but whoa...

That was cute. Why only post Christian metal bands? Oh, another crusader? Howbout some Daoist death metal? Maybe some Shinto power metal?

Dude, are you TRYING to be ridiculed?

Ha ha, yeah... you're kinda asking to be kicked repeatedly in the nutsack. Or face. Quite possibley both.

p.s. You Forgot P.O.D., dude... WTF?!

P.O.D. is my jam.

Here in the southtown... something something... WUT!

Inspiration right there.

That dude looks like a hispanic Bret Hart. It's awesome.

good thread

I don't have a problem with people being christian, they can do whatever they want, but those bands all suck something awful.

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

nah those were jsut the shitty ballads

they definitely had some "heavy metal" songs persay.

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

dreadkill said:

RichHorror said:

Finally, someone else has made that link.

Bret should have given that dude a SHARPSHOOTER years ago, and saved us all from the "yeahs" and "no matter what they say's" that band rambled on about.

and CTB please, I hate to sound like everyone else, but enough with the Christian shit. It's really fucking pathetic that you're an adult and still holding onto that sad excuse for a fucking belief system. I really have tried, since being raised in a Christian household, to be tolerant of most belief systems especially ones that pertain to godman J, but please, there is absolutely NO evidence that your buddy Jesus was anything more than a historical priest/king who got trampled by the brightest and most powerful systems of his time, and got wrapped right into the Dionysus/Osiris ideology. If you think I'm busting your balls, check it out, shit your pants, and then come back and talk about Christ.

Your "ideology" cost more in lives and historical damage/destruction than could ever be imagined being paid back to humanity.

those bands make my stomach hurt from laughing.

how do you like them apples

I'm with you, Murph. I regard grown adults who believe in God in the same manner as I would a grown adult believing in Santa Claus.

I really hate to come off sounding like a real nerdy prick, but there are so many things from the past I'd love to see/read/hear about/visit that are gone because of pure fear.

I love being human and learning about what other humans have done and gone through, and that something as trivial and ludicrous as Christ roadblocks me is a real kick in the pants. The front of the pants.

God and oil...destroyers of humanity.

pam said:

I could rant about this for the rest of my life.

Murph said:

Me too. Way to need a crutch to get through life. Way to go. Religion is fucking retarded.

I made an angry post on another board the other night when I was in a bad mood and this is the response I got:

Lamp...
I dont know you but I care about you.
There are millions of nice people out there that love you and they dont know you.
I had feelings simular to yours several years ago.
I will tell you this truth. I found a wonderful life in my faith in Jesus Christ.
Satan has been lying to you.
Read this book called "Your Best Life Now" by Joel Olsteen.
This book was the first step In my walk to recovery. It's 306 pages and a very easy read.
I love you man. Take care. I know how you feel about this subject. I'm not trying to beat you up with this, I just want you to know.

The only reason some people wake up in the morning is because it's illegal for me to suffocate them with their pillowcases. Fucking moron.

Ha ha ha ha! I love how deeply religious people think they know what they're talking about and that they can help you lead a better life.

nile: open your eye of RA
melechesh: is burn isreal a religion?
vital remians: God casting out satan did more for their songs than anything.

So. Who else believes in the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

Lamp said:


Joel Olsteen is a pussy. I saw him on Larry King once and someone called in asking about what would happen to Jews, Muslims, Bhuddists, Athiests, etc. and he wouldn't say they were going to hell. He kept saying "uh, it's not my place to judge, only God can judge, uhhh..." It was funny because Larry basically said "Well are they doomed or not? Be real, Joel, don't be a pussy."

Of course they find better lives with God, now whenever something bad happens, instead of dealing with the brevity of it they can say "it's God's will". And when they do something good, instead of taking credit for it, they say they did it because of God.

It's a perfect way to throw up your hands and not have to take responsibility for anything. Also an excellent way to not have to deal with the shortness of life.

Grow up.

ZenErik said:

Pastafarianism is where it's at.

*sigh*

It's just music, people.

He loves you.

"Hey, did you ever notice that on page 375 of this thing, it says 'Jebus'?"
"Huh...It's supposed to be Jesus, right?"

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

So you're saying that nobody ever reads the lyrics and gets into the message a band is promoting?

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

If that was the case, you would be putting up a post of all christian bands. You knew this was coming, you get what you ask for.

wouldn't*

Conquer that Baphomet dude.

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

Duuuuuuude, YOU KNEW THIS WOULD HAPPEN. I don't like to just yell at people online, and I agree that the "fuck off, godboy"s are lame, but you can't expect to not get shit for a post like this on RttP. I'm not saying to not post threads you want to post, but don't get all bummed when people aren't feeling the love. Also, it doesn't help when many of the bands that you post in order to prove good Christian metal exists are actually not good.

PS - If I recall correctly, Extol is a good Christian metal band

Dude's a closet atheist.

I like faith based metal too...faith in Satan.

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

I love how he even prefaced his post with this, and you dickbags STILL jumped at the opportunity to attack his beliefs. Which, in turn, proves his own statement that much farther.

Jaweh, Atheism, or Satan, you're all still a bunch of fucking sheep. Don't for one second think your own yard is different than the guy next door. Simply a few different lawn ornaments, nothing more.

Belief is personal, and thus unattackable and infinitely defendable. Why you even bother jumping all over this thread I'll never know. Maybe it's the only way you can feel secure in your OWN beliefs?

Funny thing is, I hate christianity. Still, I find myself embarrassed by the people pretending to defend my own beliefs in this thread. So, it's okay to listen to Blind Guardian sing tales of Middle Earth, I can hear Iron Maiden sing about the pharos in egypt, but as soon as a band sings about Christ I gotta turn off the radio and spout my vulgar opinions about the wretched nature of religion?

Retarded.

Don't blame me, I'm not listening to fucking metal.

no christ no cross
no fear no loss
no bastard son
no chosen one....
....no jesus no beast

It seems a lot of these Christian - er - "Faith Based" metal bands have the talent, what they lack is balls. Sure they can shred and blast and scream and thrash but there's no attitude behind it - it just feels too benign.

That's because a huge guy smashing giants' skulls with a hammer is way cooler than some carpenter who got nailed to a cross

thus said, Amon Amarth is all you need for your spirituality.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/14021621/teenage_holy_war/1

Uh...I never said anything about any of these bands. If a band is good, I don't give a fuck what they're singing about. In fact, I don't think anyone in this thread said anything indicating they'd turn off the radio just because a band is Christian. So maybe attacking all of us is how you prove you're so different because everyone's a sheep but you, right?

And if belief was personal, it wouldn't get shoved into people's face all the time.

the_reverend said:

I love that song.

pam said:

Pam, I am in no way trying to shove anything in anyone's face.

Honestly, maybe this board needs a little controversy, heh. Those bands I posted don't even scratch the surface on what's out there. Of course, some of you are going to hate them because you listened to them expecting to.

I will admit, I knew the flaming was going to come in hoards but I accept it because this type of thing will continue throughout my life.

I do say it's just music because all in all, music is what we enjoy and it shouldn't dictate our lives regardless of what is being sung about. I accept all kinds of bands so I'm not being stuck up but I do hold beliefs and there are bands who cater to that. I like them , you guys don't have to, that's cool. All I did was expose some bands I'm into thinking maybe someone might like it.

*Shrug*

Remember this thread? http://simple.returntothepit.com/view.php?formid=26610

*masturbate*

http://simple.returntothepit.com/view.php?formid=26610

I hate how I can't just use regular html. *shrugs*

RichHorror said:

Thanks, Rich. *fap*

It's how I do, nigga. It's how I do.

Peter Steele wrote all the lyrics for the new Type O album from a christian perspective, because he recently rediscovered his faith...so does that mean Type O is a christian band all of the sudden?

honestly, who gives a shit? When I listen to a band, I'm not thinking "I wonder what this guy worships?" as long as it's good music, i dont give a shit. Tom Araya is a catholic and goes to church regularly, does that all of the sudden mean that everything slayer put out now sucks.


And bands like Amon Amarth singing about Odin may be very cool and "metal", but it's no different than singing about christianity...it's all mythology

Neverpurified said:

Of course, it's all stories.

I mean I hate Zionism but I fucking love Orphaned land, best religious band out there. All they sing about is Judaism's stories.

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

I actually didn't mean for that to come off like I was saying you were. I'm just sick of people saying religion is off limits for ridicule because it's a "personal" thing. If it was SO personal, there'd be no pamphlets sticking out of my car windshield, I wouldn't get screamed at in Boston, and there wouldn't be religious people in every country on this fucking Earth trying to Christianize everyone. That's what I meant, it wasn't aimed at you for posting some bands.

Neverpurified said:

My favorite Slayer irony is that they have a big Nazi/WP following, and Tom Araya is NOT white. I love that.

Orphaned Land is awesome.

There's muslims, jews, and christians in Orphaned Land. The three that they always mention in their songs are of course; Islam, Christianity, and Judaism.

I'd rather listen to Arabic music than christian music. Arabic music has all kinds of cool instruments, and oh man are those lebenese singers some fine women. Then you have christian music which is pretty much country rock with all these cult looking people lifting their hands into the air.

You decide which religion has cooler music.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgkikS6b_ds
Arabic music video

or this.... silly christians, they rip off the good the bad and the ugly. Not to mention the video preachs prohibition

http://youtube.com/watch?v=SswiYEXZrIg

A lot of you are saying that you dont care what a band sings about and thats fine. I, for one, do. My favorite band is never going to be a gore metal band, because no matter how good the music, I won't be able to not laugh at the lyrics. I have no problem with "faith bassed metal" per say... I like Amon Amarth. But the belief system they adhere to is one of strength, not submission and turning the other cheek bullshit. Christian metal can't be real metal in my mind for a lot of reasons. For one, you can't sing about Jesus with some balls behind it. You might as well make the barney song metal. In order to get the edge they lack, I think you need to be angry. And you know what? They aren't the same kind of genuine pissed off that a lot, if not all, people in real metal are.

Thats my rant. At least in part.

ArrowHead NLI said:

Well said

I just like making fun of P.O.D.

This_Is_Heresy said:

I would not dismiss a band JUST because of their lyrical content, but I am big on lyrics...so lyrics I can't get behind definitely affect how much I like a band. There's nothing wrong with everything you said and everyone in this thread needs to calm the fuck down.

evil is just so much cooler, and so much more fun. its hard to get into a crushing death/black song if its about god, or maybe not openly about god, but god-based. evil just has better imagery and better things to write about. its fun to yell "SATAN! TAKE MY SOUL TO HELL!!!" and look all grim with spikes and corpse paint. its cheesy, but thats the fucking point. to look as absurd and horrifying as humanly possible. if there is a cross on a death or black metal album, it has to be inverted, or it just doesnt hold weight. i've given the christian music a chance, but it just didnt grab me. not solely because i dont believe in it, but because it was boring. happiness and hope have no place in death and black metal.

i'm sorry but i feel that death and black metal were not created for interpretation. if you play something like that, its about evil and death. our death forefathers werent thinking "this is wholesome, well rounded music that people of all faith could be a part of". no, they were thinking "fuck christ, i'll eat your fucking brain".

leave our metal alone damnit! if you want to create something based on god, you have that spiritual gospel music. metal is about horror, fear, blood, gore, and death. anything less would be uncivilized.

http://portland.craigslist.org/clc/m4w/307955969.html

Murph said:

There's not even any real evidence that Jesus existed at all.
Prove me wrong someone.

"You're not making religion better, you're making rock and roll worse"
Hank Hill on christian rock.

I usually do pay attention to lyrics and I would rather have a band with something to say with some substance than have a band go,"Worship Satan, we're evil and grim, take us seriously or you die".

There's lots of stuff out there that's both non-Satanic and non-Christian in nature. The closest I get to Christian metal is Trouble, and even that makes me vom in my mouth a bit.

Yeti said:

This is why I could never get into the Christian bands, like I posted before, they have the talent but the problem is they're trying to sanitize the music, they're taking all the balls out of it, just to make it safe and wholesome for people who might otherwise be offended by it.

Ryan_M said:

Offended by it?

HA!

Most churches in this country won't accept shows where Christian bands are playing because they think it's too evil or some crap. I will admit that most Christians in this country are really fundamentalist and stuck up and I must say I am not one of those people. They make me look bad.

I'd generally rather a band that doesn't sing about their stupid beliefs at all. Christian, Satanic, White Power, it's all a turn off for me. If I want to be preached at, I'll go to church.

What if they preach about booze, beer and banging?

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm just not evil enough to listen to Christian music. Vikings? Satan? Gore? I can handle that kind of evil. But Christianity is just too evil for me. *shudder*

RichHorror said:

Damn that Tankard! Shoving their partying beleifs down my throat!

"Thou shalt not waste and
thou shalt not spill
Just drink your beer - Commandments
Thou shalt not puke cause
there's no excuse
Just drink your beer - Commandments
Mankind was long deprived
Of the rules encased in stone
Ten written the rest were lost
When will they be found?
Laws misplaced for centuries
Where can they be? The brewery!"

RichHorror said:

I am beyond OK with that. I am a happy little boozer.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Blah Blah Blah

I have no stance on this, but I can just point out that I have never once in my life believed that Ra was the God of anything... but I still listen to some Nile. I don't believe that the devil is destined to enslave mankind, but I still listen to some Deicide. I've never drank a beer but I can still appreciate Murphy's Law. I never have any idea what the hell Morbid Angel is talking about.... ever..... but they're still one of my favorite metal bands.

just sayin.....rabblerabble

practice what you preeeeeach!!!

pam said:

you know, i can agree to an extent. but there is just an element i love about overly satanic music. they sound like they are having way more fun than "I'M SO STRONG!! I STAND UP FOR MY RIGHT!! SPIT IN THE FACE OF YOUR ENEMIES AND STAND STRONG!! UNITE FOR STRENGTH!! NOW IS THE TIME FOR ME TO RISE TO MY FEET!!". even with the satanic thing, i dont get the image that a lot of bands are trying to preach, they just write about it because Satan is so much more entertaining than god.

i know they do, but i dont pay attention to the preaching aspect.

hey CTB, you should look into Sleeping Giant
SUUUPER Christian but musically they're pretty fun

http://www.myspace.com/sleepingxgiant

I suggest Blame it on the Holy Rollers

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

Uh, its not them making you look bad.
Its your devotion to and worship of a figure, who at best was a zombie and at worst (and most likely) didn't even exist at all.

mOe said:


Eh.

I've heard better.

ArrowHead NLI said:


Actually, in my case, I didn't reference up the musical aspect of this post at all.
Sing about Christ, Yahweh, Allah, Osiris, Ra, Odin, the Great Eagle, I could care less; in fact, if you're GOOD at what you do, I applaud you.

Christianity, however, (no matter how one addresses it or advertises it)sustains itself on the promulgation and adherence to a message. Unfortunately, non-compliance with that message has cost us so much as a people, that I'm sick and fucking tired of it. When this nation (as many others) drop their RIDICULOUS religious affiliation(s) and realize that SECULAR does not mean SATANIST then I'll lay off.

This goes for all established religions: we're alone, get over yourselves, and stop being leeches.

Thanks.

*fans off Murph*
jeez, dude...its just music man listen to some Phish or something brah

mOe said:

Coheed will do.
Maybe with a splash of Bloc Party.

Dance mode.

im not gonna lie some of these bands are not so bad. its just kinda a funny concept. admiiit it.

you forgot about the new band impending doom they are how you say br00tal yo.
http://www.myspace.com/impending

dood half these bands dont even advertise their christianity. maybe they are afriad they will look dumb. or maybe they dont wanna be known as a christian band. i think having faith is stupid but ya know to each his own.

http://myspace.com/xdeathstarx as well

they have 3 vocalists.... haha

yeah the way i put it, if bury was slipknot and slipknot was actually good then you would have xDEATHSTARx

ArrowHead NLI said:

you raise a good point. however people dont slaughter each other and stomp all over anyone who opposes them in the name of Tolkien, or Imhotep. i feel that it is justifiable to shit on Christianity because they feel its right to shit on anything anyone does that rubs them the wrong way, and they are the ones that get away with it. i understand that two wrongs dont make a right, but opposition can rightfully be met with opposition. that is my opinion, i am not trying to wage a war. Christianity and Catholicism are now suffering the oppression they waged for centuries, and they are fucking crying about it. i'm not saying in any way that its wrong to believe, but that is the beauty of it all, when one says "sucks" someone says "awesome".

and Mr. Arrowhead, i'm not trying to rile you up, just stating opposition. a "free exchange of ideas" if you will.

i would hate anyone oppressing me. in anyway from anyplace. i personally feel that thinking about this stuff is a waste of time energy and frustration.

in all actuality it really is. i mean if you can think and debate about it in a civilized manner, and hear all viewpoints, there is really nothing wrong with it. but thats never the case. its always "you're wrong, i'm right" "no you're wrong, i'm right!" "LETS FUCKING FIGHT ABOUT IT!!".

and CTB, i think your threads get the most reaction. i must commend you for standing up for your beliefs, even in the face of such rampant opposition. and potentially looking bad in the face of "the metal elite".

pam said:

Am I the only one that got the Korpiklaani reference?

Why Christian metal is an oxymoron.

"I lift my hands to thee, you are the light, you are my copilot!"
Christian lyrics

"I swing the hammer in a terrible arc. Gore and blood flow from their wounds, Lord Odinn's ravens shall have feast!"
Unchristian lyrics

which one sounds better with metal?

Neither.

Yeti said:
troo but...
thats not what i mean. even a civilized convo is a waste of time IMO. infact even thinking about is there a god is a waste of time. my reasoning:

if there was a god would it fair for him to punish you for not believing in something that you were not give senses to percive and after putting you in this world? the same world with religious wars and shit. you will never know what comes after you die untill you die. And if you think you know you will never be able to prove it to someoneelse. so quit wasting your time and relying on symbols to lead your ideas. i say just be a good person according to yourself. that way you wont forget what you feel. there really is no higher standard worth acheving.

im telling this to myself i mean everyone else can do what they want im not trying to push it.

http://calvarybaptistbayshore.org/

look at their phone number

whenever I tell my mom how much I'm not down with Christ, her response goes something like this:

"You come out with stink like that. Poop! You poop mouth. Get all that poop out of your mouth."

here's a soundbyte for those still interested http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds/?id=go...te=poopmouth.txt&file=poopmouth.mp3

sxealex said:

I agree completely. We're all going to find out what happens after death when we die so we might as well spend our time on this planet actually living instead of just worrying.

y_ddraig_goch said:

Probably.
Us>Everyone else.

the_reverend said:


haha

well, i'm @ work with nothing better to do
I was born and raised Christian so, yes I do believe in God, Jesus, Heaven, etc. I dont have a problem saying it because if you would just as simply dismiss me as an idiot or wortheless because of an idea/belief I have, i'll just as soon dismiss you for that action alone. However, I do have a problem with ORGANIZED religion. When I read stories from the bible i see STORIES that should be used as ideas by which you live your life. Because, come on thats what they are. Its when people actually see them as factual stories, or just twist around what they say for purposes of personal agenda when I give it the big "fuck off." Most of the things in Christianity that I dont agree with at all are issues of organized religion, or pretty much when man puts his own spin on it. The reason I dont participate in organized christitany that much if at all now is because I got sick of the bigotry and ignorance involved. Most African American based churches are full of this and I dont like it. Who cares what music I listen to, what movies/tv I watch, who I fall in love with; I'm not killing, stealing, or being a bad person in general. Another thing is the superiority complex. "If you're not christian then you need to be and you're of the devil." No thanks. I'm not a bible thumper by any means. What you wanna do with your life is your business. I saw all of this and more in my years growing up going to church. Yes, my upbringing has a lot to do with my beliefs, but at the same time I've lead a pretty swell life. Could be better, yea but it could be a lot worse. Most kids who grow up the way I did end up in much worse situation than me. Whether or not my religious beliefs have anything to do with it, no one can truly know. But if it aint broke, dont fix it.
*shrugs* For all we know no one's right which is why i could care less about what anyone else believes. Lets just hang and have a beer, man. Listen to some tunes, maybe.

wanna know somthing i could give a fuck less if someone is christian...thanks for spreading some music sure it wasn't really my thing but im not gonna shit on ya for it....people will be what they are so you kinda just gotta deal with it man

wanna know somthing i could give a fuck less if someone is christian...thanks for spreading some music sure it wasn't really my thing but im not gonna shit on ya for it....people will be what they are so you kinda just gotta deal with it man

damn double post

damn double post

ZING!

Wow, you kids these days have such a chip on your shoulders about Christianity.
I don't give a shit what people believe in. I judge people on their actions.
Most of our political leaders worship a 45' statue of Molech and burn a fake (maybe real) human body in effigy and then have drunkin' orgies with young boys..uhhh..But hey! To each their own right?! Its just their the taxes and false flag terrorism that gets my nuts tangled!
Christ doesn't tell the PMRC to put advisory labels on CDs or tell Pro-Lifers to bomb abortions clinics. Its all about the ill nature of humanity period.
Fanaticism is part of our nature in one way or another. For each of us it just has different ways of rearing its ugly head.

Shit, I had a point! I forgot where I was going with this?!?! So fuck it nevermind! Hahaha!

I'm buck naked and my hair is wet so, see you human larvae later!

I was forced to go to Catholic school for almost 7 years. And then Christian fucking Sunday school. Hell of a lot of good that did me, way to waste your money, mom.

The best part is, the priest that married my parents and baptized me is sitting in jail right now for being a boy-toucher. I told them that motherfucker was a scummy piece of shit.

my biggest problem with the idea of faith based metal is all the years of the church and everyone else saying that metal is all about the devil and blamed for every problem that every teenager had. like a kid from a shitty family and had a shitty life killed himself because of metal, not because of his shitty parents. i remember for years being taunted by kids in junior high and high school for liking metal and they all assumed i worshipped the devil and all that shit. it's just ironic that the most evil music to them is now thier new tool to convert impressionable teenagers.

really too much for me to read at this point, this thread got carried away.
Fact: CTB has never preached his religion here, just made it obvious. Who fucking cares? Listen to what you want regardless of lyrical content. Fish on

Well, theres one point any of you made after my last post I feel the need to adress. Other than that, I think most of you got my point.

Yeti, Murph, and a few others try to make the point that christianity has been responsible for so many heinous crimes that it's okay to have such a drastic, irrational, and intolerant reaction to it. Actually, I believe its that exact kind of drastic, irrational, and intolerant type of attitude that is, in fact, responsible for these horrors you cite. Only, instead of some faux intellectual on a messageboard, the culprits were christians. I'm a practicing satanist. Do I like being represented by the faggots that like to cut up animals and commit murder in the name of satanism? Not at all.

You are revolted by the crimes of the Roman Catholic church, and more specifically: the vatican. In fact, there are MANY branches of christianity not headed by the vatican. In the roman catholics own bible, christ denounced the church, and said the true way to god was personal, and private.

Blaming a faith for the crimes of the jihadists, or radicals, is ignorant. It's half the reason jihad happens in the first place - intolerance for others who perceive the laws of life differently.

Point is, I can see having a heated debate over beliefs if he had posted his views. However, he simply posted a few bands looking for opinions, and even PREFACED it by saying he wasn't looking to debate beliefs. You and Pam jumped down this kids throat. Attacking without provocation. I don't care if you're christian, atheist, buddhist, or satanist. If you're lashing out like that, it's not working for you. Try something else, because your current beliefs have taught you to be all the things you seem to hate christianity for.

And pam, I wasn't trying to imply that all of you were sheep, and I wasn't. I just assumed you already knew it.

While history may piss you(and me) off contemporary humanity is a product of it not responsible for it.
As for more current events there is no need to group people based on the acts of others.
Believe me i would disown humanity if it was easy. But im still definately human.

ive met some pretty sweet christians. i just hate it when they bring their beliefs to the table like a name drop.

I have no idea what you're talking about, Arrowhead.

Screw all of you. Really.

<3

i believe in tom cruise. he is the king of gay.

I wish Tom Cruise would make with getting dead. He's a terrible actor.

Well, I was not going to say anything, but when "faux intellectual" comes into the conversation, then it becomes insulting.

Your idea that having a "drastic, irrational, and intolerant" reaction to Christianity actually created all the reasons why I'm so anti-Christian is such an overused cliche and downright ridiculous. (So people are murdered because they are anti-murder?) In fact, it doesn't even make sense. Read my reasons above for why I feel the way I do, and not one points to me, or any other free-thinking individual past or present, having done anything to deserve death or blacklisting other than feeling differently and/or setting those feelings in print.

Also, my issue is not just with Roman Catholicism, but with the many offshoots from early Christian tradition that demolished many cultures and beliefs (Arianism, Literalist Christianity, the writings of Justin Martyr and Clement of Alexander to name a few). Roman Catholicism did not fully register itself until the third-fourth century AD, by which time many "godman" traditions were in jeopardy due to politcal and religious furor. (Goodbye to many amazing texts)

And I don't make my argument against Christianity for anyone else to jump ship and join me. I understand fully how radical my feelings are, and maybe somewhat jaded, but it's just how I feel. Your thought that "my current beliefs" have me spinning in circles is another cliche amongst cliches in that rant. Seriously, you write as if what you say is sound and concrete, but is actually rather weak and unsubstantiated.

You're not smarter than everyone else, so stop trying to climb into my head and tell me why think the way I do. "Attacking without provocation" has worked well for many religions, I think its time someone else attacks, except this time with purpose.

Once again, very well said Murph.

It's people who stand for genocide, intolerance, and exclusiveness. Jesus came to be the antithesis of everything humanity does wrong.

Religion sucks, we all agree with that. I personally hate legalism and it's one of the things that is killing this world. I don't endorse wars fought over who has the right translation or who's law is more correct. If you look on my myspace, I have a picture that says, "Free From Religion" and I stand by that.

When I decided to become a Christian, I decided to do it for the relationship I would get out of it. I didn't and still don't give a crap about what people think about Jesus or religion because opinions don't matter in the long run. I still respect all of you and I think I'm right in asking for it in return.

genocide is the only way

Well, I understand more clearly now reading Arrowhead's post how he/she was trying to correlate my reaction with the reaction of Christians.

I just don't feel they are the same in any sense, but that is just me.

p.s. thanks a lot Jesus, I shot an 84 today at Middlebrook.

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

Usually, when I think of someone who does everything right, I don't think of someone hanging by nails from wood at the age of 33. Something went WRONG there, if it in fact played out anywhere close to how it is currently perceived.

Also, I love metal and none of you can take that away. If they want to sing about Armageddon from a Christian point of view or whatever, they have that right and it still rocks. There are VERY FEW "Christian" bands who actively write lyrics worshipping Christ. They are believers IN a band and they don't have to write about it all the time to still be Christians.

Murph said:

His purpose was to die and be raised again. It wasn't an accident of what happened. Period.

Christ died for his own sins, not for ours.

Lamp said:

That's your belief but it's not the truth.

I personally do not want to start wars with you people and that's why I haven't "preached". I wasn't going to anyway.

And please, you tell me what sins he committed so I can throw away my beliefs and become a Hindu.

You're such an easily offended fuck.

I personally don't give a shit if the band is Christian or not. If the music is good, I'll take it. If it's a buncha crap and cheese put together by some musical hacks to preach, fuck it.
In fact, I like to go out of my way to check out Christian Metal and Hardcore bands to try to dig up those rare gems that stick out among the garbage. You always find at least one here and there.

For example, old Extol is the balls.

like http://www.myspace.com/apsiody

http://www.genocide.org/
http://www.lostwisdom.com/
http://www.continuity.us/
http://www.pragmatism.us/
http://www.anarchy.net/
http://www.burzum.com/
http://www.fuckcapitalism.com/
http://www.fuckchrist.com/
http://www.hessian.org/
http://www.ihatejobs.com/
http://www.nihil.org/
http://www.pan-nationalism.org/
http://www.anonhost.org/
http://www.infoterror.com/
http://www.amerika.org/
http://www.zionists.com/
http://www.juliusevola.com/
http://www.sataniccoalition.com/
http://www.necrocapitalist.org/
http://www.sodomy.org/

Let me get this straight- your religion preaches that two thousand years ago, a middle eastern virgin was impregnated by a ghost. And the spawn of this ethereal sperm grew up to walk on water and multiply bread loaves and heal the sick and raise the dead and cast out literal demons. And this Love child was not just any ordinary spud, it was God incarnate who willingly submitted to a bloody S&M crucifixation to pay for OUR sins, when it would have been much easier (and less messy) if he would have merely made us sin-proof in the first place. And this Miracle Baby, son of a (cough) virgin, rose from the dead after three days and now gets very upset when heavy metal musicians slander his name. And Moses parted the red sea, Noah had an arc, God rained frogs on Egypt, and Joshua made the sun stand still. And even though Adam and Eve gave birth to two boys (one of whom killed the other ), the human race somehow fruitfully multiplied while avoiding the sin of incest. And remote polynesian islanders will boil in molten lava eternally if they do not embrace the gospel , even if they have never even had the chance to hear the gospel. And the God that gave you a weenie will also zap you with a lightning bolt if thou darest toucheth the weenie which he didst create...

(The Redneck Manifesto )

Agrippa said:

TO HELL WITH THE DEVILLLLL!!!

ConquerTheBaphomet said:

What is the truth, then?

pro christ said:

hey i think this is ctb's band?

ALLAH U AKBAR

Murph said:

I actually had some well thought out points to make to this. Seeing you still trying to justify jumping down this kid's throat without provocation made me want to jump right back in and defend the underdog some more. However, I see that Conqueror has decided he will in fact bring his beliefs into this argument, so at this point I leave him to defend himself.

As for your own points, murph, they're weak. Especially the part where you refer to my statements as "cliche". I'd love to see you link any single fucking proof of redundancy in what I've said. Disagree if you like, but your accusation there would be naught but a bullshit cop-out.

And again, there is no difference at all between one type of intolerance and another. You're showing intolerance to Christianity at it's merest mention. How you feel that is any way different than the churches past atrocities baffles me. And AGAIN, you've shown that EVERY problem you have is with varying CHURCHES of christ. I still have yet to see you make one useful point against christ himself. Personally, as I've said, I've had no use for the almighty teriyaki man. However, I would never deprive CTB of his right to worship him, nor would I try to dissuade him from believing something that helps him find peace.

If he were to do something bad in the name of christ, then I would say or do something. But then, you'll notice that YOU act like an asshole, and I ALSO say or do something. That's the point, and ironically it's one of the founding principles of Satanism. I don't care WHAT you believe, and mopst likely neither does CTB. For you to rip in and blast him like that was something he didn't ask for or deserve, so I stood up for him. And to quell your ridiculous fear of Christianity, if he were to attack your own beliefs in such a way, I would have stood up for you as well.

I don't care what your faith is. I only care what it makes you do.

Murph said:

The truth is, we all share a planet. We can't get rid of ALL the assholes, but a lot of us could try a little harder not to BE the assholes.


Myself included.

Thanks douche! I had finally stopped having fucking nightmares about that guy.

Man this kid sucks. Here are some really good atheist bands...
link
link
link
No one does that shit. asshole.

ArrowHead NLI said:

Well, there was really no redundancy in what you said, by you. HOWEVER, your point that intolerance spurns the ills of both sides to an argument is fucking CLICHE. There are varying degrees of intolerance, as there varying degrees of everything. Our legal system dictates that the form of punishment does not always directly mirror the severity of the crime. That's why not all murderers are killed, rapists raped/castrated, etc. I would not lay a finger on anyone because of their beliefs, and would never do anything besides argue. It's a sensitive topic, but for me, it's worth the discussion: no more. The position that simple emotion or states of mental being correlate and equate is childish; if that view was seriously held by more people, there would be no cause for uprising, challenging the system, creating freedom for oppression because then the "defactors" would be charged with the same crimes as their oppressors? NOPE.

Also, you said earlier that my problem was with the Roman Catholic church, and now "agree" with something you believe you said earlier (you did not) that I have issues with varying Christian churches. Pick a side of your own argument and stick with it.

Not once did I make an argument that made my opinion anywhere near the "faults" I perceive in Christianity. I do not destroy Christian texts, nor do I try in any way to prevent them from worship, nor do I suppress any information whatsoever. I did not address intolerance and adherence as my motivating factor, merely that the damage was done. At that time, it was mostly political anyway, but these things still happened and continue to happen today (non-profit Christian groups endorsing particular candidates, tax-breaks way overboard from our government, the attacks on homosexuality and pregnancy). Your parallel about intolerance in jihadists and radicals and mine is a societal cliche, my friend. My "intolerance and ignorance" is miles away from that behavior, and I'm sick of people who believe that fervor = terrorism. They are not of the same condition, there are millions of ways one can choose to express their beliefs. Putting my opinion on par with the same that drives those factions is ridiculous.

I could write for years about my issues with the historical Christ, and the subsequent dissemination of his life and message. No one hear wants to read that: if they do, I'll write a paper and send her out.

I never said anything about CTB not being able to worship anything his hearts desires, and actually (though I don't know him) think he's a nice kid who posts some great stuff on here and gets treated with much hostility. I would only give him ribbing for his Christian status, but to me, everyone is a human and deserves every right that I do.
For you to call me an "asshole" for voicing my opinion and giving evidence and at least an point-of-view for each of my reasonings, goes against your view that "everyone should be able to feel or worship how they please." If you only care what people's views or beliefs make them do, and think I'm an asshole, then realize the only thing I do is speak occasionally and write my meanderings once in a great while on this messageboard. If that puts me in your scope, whether as a Satanist or not, does not bother me. It's a messageboard, and while it may seem geeky or unnecessary, sometimes these discussions arise, just as they do in human interaction.

I have no problem with you calling my points weak, but at every available moment I have given a source or direct link to my motivation.

Murph said:

I never called you an asshole. I said you acted like one. That's your first post here, in a thread where a kid stated he did NOT want to argue beliefs.

If you haven't gotten my point by now, I don't think you will. I've said quite a few times, I don't give a crap what you believe, only how you behave. You jumped all over a non-opportunity to rip apart and criticize a person's beliefs. A person who had expressed he was NOT here to do that.

The saddest part is that you keep missing the fact I AGREE with you politically. I just chose not to use this thread to spout my opinions. Well, at least not those opinions. I guess in the end, I'm just as guilty of de-railing this shit as you are.

Just because he did not want to argue belief doesn't mean anything to me. The post was for Christian bands, and what makes a Christian band is a devotion to Christ. I commented, harshly, that I don't fucking get it, and that is dismays me greatly.

If I posted, "hey check out these great White Power bands (which I would never do because that is against my feelings completely)" but said I didn't feel like arguing racial issues, do you think I'd still draw criticism?

CTB pretty much chose not to argue with me, and I feel that's just as respectable as if he had chosen to argue.

Arguments have to start somewhere, however, and this time, for probably the first time ever for me on here, I did start it.

my contribution:

You want sushi farts? I got sushi farts. Come on down.

I've already stated that I respect each and every one of you, so arguing on this board is only going to complicate matters.

I like to discuss what I believe in with the intent of just sharing it, not trying to convert someone. It is not my job to save anybody but just to share what I know. Personally, if you choose to cut me down and ridicule me, please do because that just shows that what I have to say makes an impact to you.

I stated that I didn't want to argue my beliefs not because I'm ashamed of what I believe in, but because it causes riffs in the well-being of the board. I want to stay here and I would rather much not deal with hostility until the day I've decided I have had enough.

As far as the church and its past, I would have to agree I am deeply ashamed and appalled at the methods used against "heathens". I do NOT condone anything despicable the church has done and I sincerely apologize for every Christian who has given themselves a bad name or has treated you unfairly. These people who make a mockery of Christ are the ones I do not stand with, I stand against. It was NOT Jesus' mission to come here and decide to start ANOTHER world religion full of bigotry, jealousy and intolerance. Those actions were taken by his followers on very vain and blind affairs.

Please do not associate me with the embarassment of this world.

Oh and let me add for the record, I DESPISE Catholicism and anything associated with it. They are the cause of most of the church's hypocrisy and acts of murder, etc. in our history's past.

Catholocism= White Man Voodoo

Is there a band called Catholocaust yet?

Troll said:

can i get a witness?

Murph said:

can't we like, dig a hole and fill it with ALL the christians, muslims and jews and then put a bunch of dirt back on top and call it a day?

You know, I still wanna know how the fuck I "jumped down" CTB's throat. I'm one of the few people on this board who doesn't tell him to get fucked all the time just because he likes jesus. All I said was for someone that thinks it sucks when people get down on him for being into jesus, it was pretty dumb to post this thread...as it would attract all of the above.

I then stated my feelings on religion. I didn't know stating my opinion was jumping down someone's throat. I have no problem with CTB. We're MySpace friends...that's quality shit right there.

So go fuck yourself, Arrow, (and I mean that in the least sincere way, as this is the internet) but leave me out of your ranting...I have no issue with the kid and if people's opinions on religion are "attacks", that's fucking news to me. Why don't you spend 10 paragraphs looking down your nose at the 20 fucking people on this thread that specifically told CTB to fuck off/fuck himself/get fucked, etc.

Thanks, guy.

Coldnorthernvengeance said:

For example.

The Catholics headed the anti-slavery movement.
Therefore, if you hate Catholics you are racist.
Drunk Irish and Germans that came to this country were Catholic.
Therefore, if you hate Catholics you hate alcohol and are a gay.
Catholicism is the world's greatest religion.
You can go do some smack, fuck a goat, molest children and any number of things, then just go to confessional and be forgiven.
I think I am going to become a Catholic and raise my children Amish.

pam said:


Ha. I stopped picking on your posts what, like two days ago? At least Murph could defend himself with some small amount of reason. You bored me a long time ago. Why even post? You wanted my attention again?

I'm not looking down my nose at you, Pam. You're way back in the rear-view mirror. Stop being so bitter that I'm better than you.

i dont feel like reading anymore i blame the jews

the thing that i find amusing in this thread is how you ppl continue to debate christianity and " what's right".. " what's wrong"... when this thread started about music.. which is what always happens when anyone even thinks the word religion... here come the pitch forks and lighted torches b/c someone disagrees with someone else about religion..
you are all perfectly proving that regardless of the whether or not the music is good... if there is religon involved.. SOMEONE will have to argue their opinoin of "faith"... or disbelief in it.
when the basic fact is that... you are merely arguing personal opinions and will therefore never agree.. b/c everyone's opinion of religion is different .. It always has been .. and always will be that way..
so give it up.. you can't expect your opinions to be understood by everyone and it is a dissapointing effort if you think otherwise..

Wow. I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were fucking retarded. That's the most idiot statement I've ever read. Nevermind, carry on.

ariavette said:

you people keep it going by debating the same fucking arguement over and over again....let it go for fuck's sake

seems like CTB is just saying that these bands get ignored solely for the fact that they are identified in some way with a religion

Doesn't seem like he said or did anything to challenge anyone's beliefs or belittle someone else's opinions.


I miss my sushi farts pretty fiercely.

I think I read somwhere that sushi + beer = nuclear devastation. I think it was einstein that said that sometime after his theory of relativity.

the funniest thing in this thread is it is being discussed as if Jesus was an actual person.
It's fucking SANATA CLAUS people!!

i believe in santa jesus. he died so that we could have coal in our stockings

Josh_Martin said:

SANATA CLAUS is much more badass than SANTA. I'm down to recognize the name change.

brian_dc said:

EXACTLY. You just summed up everything I was saying.

i still blame the jews

Josh_Martin said:

Actually, there's enough historical documentation to show that Christ was a real person or people. The debate is whether or not he was divine.

And Pam, I'm not quite sure how you confuse perfect, witty, handsome, and charming with "fucking retarded".

brian_dc said:

look at underoath haste the day and as i lay dying they don't get ignored, but then again they're not true metal they are metal core.

xanonymousx said:

I don't really like any of those bands.

Another point that I would like to make (and I think someone earlier mentioned this) is that being a Christian is having a faith in Jesus but playing music is different. When I'm writing lyrics with my band, I'm not looking at it like I have to convert someone with what I'm writing about. That's not my aim. I write about subjects of humanity, like greed, corruption, destruction, and hypocrisy. Some Christians in bands are not compelled to make a ministry out of their work. They may write about faith but as a personal overtone.

Can I still ask you if you're conquering the baphomet every so often or would I be objective?