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returntothepit >> discuss >> I think I'm going to best buy today to by an HD video camera by the_reverend on Nov 8,2009 12:35pm
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toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 8,2009 12:35pm
i will probably just end up returning it, but what should I look for? there is no restocking fee at best buy, right?



toggletoggle post by Captain Obvious at Nov 8,2009 2:03pm
Thanks for the Twitter update.



toggletoggle post by porphyria at Nov 8,2009 2:10pm
Nikon D90, that way you can use all your lenses :-D



toggletoggle post by gslice at Nov 8,2009 2:24pm
my ancient camera doesn't do hd, but I would recommend anything with minidv, and I've always been partial to Sony



toggletoggle post by aril at Nov 8,2009 2:27pm
I've got a jvc- not sure of the exact model but it's excellent and has lasted me a few years.



toggletoggle post by aaron_michaelNLI at Nov 8,2009 3:23pm
there are those tiny little guys. don't remember the name, so I'm actually hurting. not helping. FLiP or some shit? I think that's the name.

they're fun. we used them.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 8,2009 3:42pm
minidv is outdated technology. no thanks. the flips are for little clips for youtube.
"Samsung 2.07mp hd with 2.7 color touch screen lcd monitor 399.99 on sale"



toggletoggle post by notorious_D.U.G. at Nov 8,2009 3:46pm
yes there is a restocking fee. and a 15 day return policy on cameras.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 8,2009 3:49pm
porphyria said[orig][quote]
Nikon D90, that way you can use all your lenses :-D
yeah, that is why I'm probably going to return it cause i want a D700s w/ video.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 8,2009 3:51pm
notorious_D.U.G. said[orig][quote]
yes there is a restocking fee. and a 15 day return policy on cameras.
10% restocking fee? i would only need to use it for about 2-weeks so that would be perfect. $40 for a 2-week camera rental wouldnt be bad.



toggletoggle post by pam   at Nov 8,2009 3:55pm
the_reverend said[orig][quote]
porphyria said[orig][quote]
Nikon D90, that way you can use all your lenses :-D
yeah, that is why I'm probably going to return it cause i want a D700s w/ video.


I thought you were not interested in camera/video combos?



toggletoggle post by notorious_D.U.G. at Nov 8,2009 3:57pm
15% and don't bring it back to my store if you are only "renting" it.



toggletoggle post by gslice at Nov 8,2009 6:42pm
the_reverend said[orig][quote]
minidv is outdated technology.
false, you can keep your hard drives with no backup and irreversible data loss, I'll stick to keeping hard copies of my video

if you are going for quality, stick to panasonic and sony



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 8,2009 7:03pm
sansung probably used the same exact parts as sony as they do with their TVs.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 8,2009 7:27pm
also, backing up is 100% easy. If you think they are safe on a minidv, you are on massive amounts of drugs. All of my videos would be backed up at home in 2 places and to a remote location.



toggletoggle post by gslice at Nov 8,2009 7:32pm
when I was researching cameras I consistently read that sony and panasonic are the top of the heap in all aspects, jvc and samsung were always at or near the bottom, I've never owned anything but sony and everything else I've used has been pretty meh in comparison, but if you're looking to spend less than $400 everything you look at will be pretty middle of the line shitty, and if you are just looking for 2 weeks of vidja tapin, go with whats cheap

but I'd still recommend minidv if you're going to be capturing and keeping precious family moments



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 9:45am
so I guess I'm going to go to BB at lunch and look. will probably just buy something.



toggletoggle post by carina working from home at Nov 9,2009 10:03am
don't rush to buy something only to return it...do some research online...



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 12:38pm
so I guess I'm going to go to BB at lunch and look. will probably just buy something.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 12:40pm
wow.... the cheapest at best buy was $799...



toggletoggle post by ouchdrummer   at Nov 9,2009 1:37pm
now THAT'S a sticky situation.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 1:44pm



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 1:46pm
$536.91 with shipping and handling.



toggletoggle post by carina working from home at Nov 9,2009 2:13pm
you should dign up for free prime shipping...since you haven't done that yet...



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 2:15pm
yes I did. and if I try prime again, they will charge me $29 or something like that.



toggletoggle post by carina working from home at Nov 9,2009 2:47pm
hang on...i'll see if i can get it for free



toggletoggle post by xmikex at Nov 9,2009 3:35pm
gslice said[orig][quote]
the_reverend said[orig][quote]
minidv is outdated technology.
false, you can keep your hard drives with no backup and irreversible data loss, I'll stick to keeping hard copies of my video


backed.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 5:53pm
what is it like writing all your term papers on 3.5" disk



toggletoggle post by gslice at Nov 9,2009 7:07pm
no, its like taking 16 hours of video, getting around to ripping it to your computer, then dropping it off of your desk and losing EVERYTHING

miniDVD's on the other hand will skip while recording if you move the camera too quickly or if you're filming something loud (or so I've heard from many grizloch-esque types)

miniDV tapes don't do any of those things and capture in comparable quality, AND they are getting cheaper because so many point-and-shooters are buying the "less-outdated" technology



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 8:02pm
so... swapping SD sticks that are $16-$30 for 8-16GB. SD's don't skip either. And unlike HD or minidv, they have no moving parts. then if you drop the world trade center on them, you still get a recording out of the SD: http://www.billbiggart.com/



toggletoggle post by gslice at Nov 9,2009 8:48pm
I've never used SD for video, but I still feel that, at least for what I do, taping 10 shows worth of video on a single card runs a greater chance of losing everything than using 15 tapes, whether it be losing the physical card or accidentally magnetizing it

but then, were a skyscraper to fall on my tapes I'd definitely be screwed, so if you see that happening in your near future...

obviously, get what works for you, then start video taping all those sweet boston shows that I never get to go to



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 9:01pm
I would never shoot 15 shows on one card.
full HD means 2:55 for 32GB.

buy a couple cards @ 16GB and then swap them. Right there, you are typed with minidv. Now create a work-flow to back up the cards on your computer/server/etc... You can suck off a lot more with SD since you don't need the camera to suck them off. With minidv, you need the camera to suck anything off at all.

CHANCES OF DEMAGNETIZING MINIDV = 100%
CHANCES OF DEMAGNETIZING SD = 0%
http://www.webraydian.com/content/view/219/32/
When traveling, X-Rays have never been shown to corrupt the data on, or damage, a digital camera memory card. The memory card is also not magnetic in nature so the motors in the X-Ray machine's conveyor belt should not be able to cause any harm either.



toggletoggle post by gslice at Nov 9,2009 9:29pm
the way I see it, I've had hard drives die on me, I've had flash drives die on me, I have yet to have a tape die on me

I know that SD cards aren't quite flash drives, but I can't imagine they aren't susceptible to random crapping out, and sure I've purchased tapes that were crap from go, but I didn't waste an hour of my time and energy taping precious memories just to have them magically zapped out of existence, I tossed it when my camera wouldn't read it and moved on, and at 2 (theoretical) dollars, I didn't lose much

you know way more about this technology stuff than I do, and would probably do the reasonable thing and make 47 copies of you're files so they don't disappear forever, I on the other hand, don't have the resources or knowledge to do that, so I store everything I tape on 3 hard drives and in 4 shoe boxes full of tapes, cause I'm cool like that

this is the first I've spent more than a second looking at SD cards for vidja, it's pretty sweet that they have moved on from hard drives that everyone was creaming their jeans about 2 years ago, but I (personally) am not sold on it yet



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 9,2009 10:34pm
SD cards ARE flash and here is a post that I was trying to find.
SD cards have MTBF (mean time bettwen failure) up to 1,000,000h.
(some even have 4,000,000h)
So even if you use the card 24h/day that will last 114 years!!

Common misunderstanding of MTBF.
An MTBF of 1000000h means that it can fail after 50 or 5000h.
Not likely at all. But it can.

MBTF I found for minidv is 5000h... but my computer is eating shit and being slow right now.



toggletoggle post by grizloch   at Nov 10,2009 1:16am
most hard drives quote anywhere "UP TO" 500,000h to 2,000,000h mtbf, even if that's true 95% of the time you still run the risk of your shit blowing up for no apparent reason, for instance my seagate which lasted just long enough to transfer 20 gigs of data, I doubt SDs are much better

minidv tapes might only last 5000h, but you are going to use it on average for 2 hours, once to capture, once to rip, unless you plan on re-using it, which is generally a bad idea anyway, so it will be good until the tape breaks down in fubudjamni houryeardays

I figure it's like using a mac for editing video, sure it's gonna be way better and when everything is going great its orgasmic, until the one time it crashes and you have to start all over again from scratch, it's a matter of preference, get fucked up front or after a romantic candle-lit dinner



toggletoggle post by sxealex   at Nov 10,2009 1:27am
no moving parts = safer. end of story yes?



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 10,2009 2:53am
grizloch is funny cause he's comparing something to a seagate drive. seagate drives failure rate for me is almost 100%. why don't you compare turkeys instead. All of the reasons against SD that you have brought up have actually been reasons against miniDV.



toggletoggle post by menstrual_sweatpants_disco   at Nov 10,2009 8:06am
I have a solid state HD camcorder. I had a sony one with a HDD but it was a piece of shit, and the constant (although tiny) vibrations from loud (VERY loud) music would keep tripping the fucking drop sensor in it and it would stop recording and error. Laaaaame.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 10,2009 10:14am
what did you end up with?



toggletoggle post by menstrual_sweatpants_disco   at Nov 10,2009 10:33am
It's a couple years old now.. but it's a Panasonic HDC-SD1.

http://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-HDC-SD1-De...-Camcorder-Stabilized/dp/B000LO92EK

1080i. Records onto SDHC cards.

I also chose that camera because it was the ONLY consumer grade camcorder I could find at the time that recorded onto flash memory AND had an external 1/8" stereo jack for a condenser mic.



toggletoggle post by menstrual_sweatpants_disco   at Nov 10,2009 10:36am
It's also pretty sturdy:



bennyhillifier



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 10,2009 11:19am
awe.. a 3CCD one? that is sick. I wanted the newer version of that but it's more than I will ever use and it's light on the wide angle.



toggletoggle post by menstrual_sweatpants_disco   at Nov 10,2009 11:41am
Yeah, honestly I can't offer too much advice on the video side. HD wasn't even a requirement for me, but that camera was the only one that fit my criteria and it was HD just by luck (although a little more pricey than I wanted). Now that I have the HD, though I'm glad. It's awesome.



toggletoggle post by the_reverend   at Nov 10,2009 11:42am
if I were to spend any more than $500, I would spend $5000.



toggletoggle post by grizloch   at Nov 10,2009 12:24pm
I'll say it again, I've had hard drives fail, I've had flash drives fail, I've never had a minidv tape fail

I will also say again that I've never used SD cards for video



toggletoggle post by revabee at Nov 10,2009 6:57pm
yet yet yet.
I have have HDs, CDs, DVD-r's, minidv's, minicassete, and compact flash fail, but not SD yet.

max resolution for on a 16GB SD gives you about 2HRs. 19 seconds of recording time was 52MB.
schnikies.



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